Posted on Monday, 2/09/2009 - 9:28 p.m. PST — by bud
You mean the accused will be allowed to defend himself? What a concept!
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Joined: May 2008
Current Posts: 14
i think what Rains is trying to say is that buris is already trying the case in the media, and that his client cant defend himself. Mehserle has a right to defend himself, whether people like it or not. there have been too many false accuations that have come from the judge, and buris and others. .... and the fact that the media and newspapers are printing the wrong facts.
Joined: Jan 2009
Current Posts: 26
So Mehserle and his attorney want tell their side of what actually happened, huh. Mehserle is entitled to free speech under the First Amendment of the US Constitution. So he should be entitled to represent himself in court, speak with the news media and go on all the talks shows, including Jerry Springer. Let him talk. LET HIM TELL HIS SIDE OF THE STORY. Because I am courious about what he and his attorney has to say about the videos that shows him murdering Grant and the witnesses who saw him do it. He is still an American, ALLOW THIS MAN HIS RIGHT TO FREEDOM OF SPEECH AND EXPRESSION. He could start with wearing a T-Shirt that says, "I AM THE FORMER BART POLICE OFFICER WHO RESIGNED FROM MY POSITION BASED ON VIDEO EVIDENCE AND WITNESS ACCOUNT OF ME MURDERING GRANT IN COLD-BLOOD. Now THAT is freedom of expression. And he has every right to wear a T-Shirt like that and let the T-Shirt freely speak for him. I FOR ONE WILL SUPPORT HIS RIGHT TO DO SO! That message should be on the front and the back of his T-Shirt so it will give people something to read while THAT COWARD'S back is turned.
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 19
i see
Joined: May 2008
Current Posts: 80
The gag order is highly inappropriate - a violation of free speech and the First Amendment. It should never have been issued in the first place. Attorney John Burris has acted irresponsibly and criminally in this and his other high-profile cases. He has issued numerous inflammatory statements which have directly lead to violence, riots and vandalism. His sole purpose is to spread misinformation to win the case and earn millions. He must be held accountable for his criminal activities and have his law license revoked by the California Bar for unprofessional and criminal conduct. I have asked the FBI to determine if he has any links to terrorist organizations - because he is surely acting like one.
Joined: Jan 2009
Current Posts: 26
Good idea! Black attorney John Burris should be held accountable for exercising his First Amendment Right because he commented on the Grant's civil case because he is not representing the criminal part of Grant's murder case. WOW!! That is so clever and oh so profound. APPLAUSE, APPLAUSE!!!
BUT, you do know what that means now? The White former BART officer Johnnes Mehserle will have to go BACK to jail, where he belong, just like all the other criminals, and wait until he is tried for first degree murder and GET THE DEATH PENALTY! Boy, Fool. You are some kind of genius. BRILLIANT, BRILLIANT! More APPLAUSE. Mooore APPLAUSE!!!
It just would not be fair if Burris has to answer to a non criminal offence with a legal flogging because he is black and the sadistic murderer Mehserle is running around, foot loose, fancy free and posing a threat to society because he is white. TO DO SO, WOULD NOT BE JUSTICE!!
I cannot speak for everyone on this forum, but to me, it's the only right thing to do. Legally flog Burris for a noncriminal act in exchange for putting a criminal back in jail where he belongs. FAIR DEAL!!!
Joined: Oct 2008
Current Posts: 34
What's the point in lifting the gag order? Mehserle had plenty of time to explain himself or to apologize to Mr. Grant's family prior to there being a gag order. That might have made a difference in terms of public perception. But since he's clearly not about to do that, how is he being harmed by this gag order? I can understand the judge not looking kindly on having court documents leaked to the press, particularly something as inflammatory to the community as the bail application.
Also, whatever Burris is doing is completely irrelevant to the present case. This is a criminal case, and Burris has no standing in it, so a gag order would not apply to him. Nor would it be appropriate since he has not leaked court documents or has access to them, since the criminal case is being brought by Alameda D.A., not Burris or Grant's family.
Joined: Jan 2009
Current Posts: 26
Now how many times do I have to tell these antagonistic, riot inciting racist to keep me out of their forums? You are NOT going to make me do anything. You can talk about me all you want. YOU DON'T KNOW ME. And if I don't want you to know me, you are NOT GOING to know me. No amount of backbiting or critism is going to make me do anything. Everytime you antagonize me by putting including my username in your comments, you are going to deal with the consequences. There's a reason for the ignore list on the forum. And that is to get rid of all of the garbage!!
Joined: Dec 2007
Current Posts: 129
We do know you, because you write your thoughts, which are most often about race and name-calling and how marvelous you are. I would prefer not to comment about other people, and it would be better if we all just stuck to the issue at hand. I reject the notion that it's all about race, even if some segments of our society have more problems than others.
Joined: Jan 2009
Current Posts: 26
Everybody is responsible for what they do, including what they write. Children are usually taught that they are responsible for what they do. But what does that have to do with the cost of tea in China?! Race, profanity and how marvelous you claimed that I said I was in my writings is all you choose to see about me. Your beliefs about me without all the facts is on YOU. I do not owe you any explaination nor do I have to prove anything to you. Ive lived in America all of my life. I know what I have experienced, observed and witnessed. And ain't nobody is going to tell me otherwise.
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 19
You have FIRE!!! It's awesome to see.
Joined: Feb 2008
Current Posts: 69
Ah...the Burris haters are blaming John Burris in a case that he isn’t even working on. Typical, I tell you, very typical. Why dont yall blame the cop who shot Grant in the back instead of everybody else? I know why, because most if not all of you trolls never lived up to your ability or your privileged lot in life and your only way to feel important about yourselves is to lash out at a successful black man. Its funny, on one hand, you trolls talk about blacks who aren’t being "productive" members of society, and then on the other hand, you continuously blast one of the most successful black attorneys in the bay area, for being, well, good at what he does. Listen, If police departments around here didn’t routinely violate people's civil rights, there would be no need for a person like Burris to exist. Maybe you guys should find another scapegoat for your rants.
Joined: Dec 2007
Current Posts: 129
I think the reason we're unhappy with John Burris has less to do with his financial and professional success than with his failure to really help the black community in Oakland. I find it difficult to believe that the flatlanders accept the level of crime they experience. Nonetheless, all indications are that they tolerate criminals in their midst.
My guess is that the majority of blacks in Oakland are decent folks. Why they don't rise up and help their own community is a perplexing mystery to the rest of us.
Joined: Jul 2008
Current Posts: 70
Judging from some of the exchanges in this forum, I'd say that the gulf that lies between us is a matter of class, not race.
Joined: Jan 2009
Current Posts: 26
To imply that black people are not helping their community because they are taking a stand against racism is ludicrous. Racism is the main reason why most black communities are riddled with so much crime and violence. Taking a stand against racism is how African American can help themselves and their community the most.
White people, whether they are racist or not, are always trying to justify white racist views towards blacks by implying that blacks need to focus more crime and violence in their own neighborhood. What the HECK you think we are doing when we are out there protesting, because one of our children was murdered by racist cops and white Americans are trying to cover up that fact?! The white structure system ignore our concerns and treat us like we are not Americans, and therefore, "we are not entitle to the same rights and previleges as they have because they are white and we're NOT". NOT ACCEPTING RACISM IS HELPING OUR COMMUNITY!!! Racism is mainly where most of our problems lies, both in our communities and our personal lives.
Obviously, most white Americans cannot begin to comprehend the impact slavery has on black Americans. In spite of the fact that slavery of black Americans legally ending over one hundred and forty years ago. Racism received from white people has taken its toll on African Americans. But, overcoming racism is what we, as black Americans, need to do to help ourselves and our communities.
Joined: May 2008
Current Posts: 14
an OFFICER shot someone.. an accident.... that is what happened.... so where did the slavery thing come into play? like you said, that was over 150 years ago....
"Racism received from white people has taken its toll on African Americans. But, overcoming racism is what we, as black Americans, need to do to help ourselves and our communities."
so since Jan 1st, in Oakland, there have been, what, like 9 shootings.... you are telling me thats Whities fault? and out of how many shootings and murders last year,(70% which were committed by african americans in the commission of a crime, most likely gang and or drug transactions) is the white persons?
now this is just an observation, this was an isolated incident, the other 300 shootings and various drug and gang crimes that will happen, you wont give a rats A S (s) about, you will blame the white people. point the finger instead of trying to help your community.
"Obviously, most white Americans cannot begin to comprehend the impact slavery has on black Americans"
hey, im over it, and i think 98% of americans are over it.... (not counting the KKK, WP, AB , BP, BG, and other racist gangs , etc...) they in my mind are not even human in their thingking. stop holding a grudge, get on with your life and fight for you community. deal with the others issues at hand. this one inncident was isoalated, and what is thie going to help your community, rioting and destroying your own community.... this is the mentality i dont get.
Joined: Nov 2008
Current Posts: 601
"Obviously, most white Americans cannot begin to comprehend the impact slavery has on black Americans."
My Aunts, Uncles, and cousins are still in the fields choppin' lettuce, so you can just cry me a river.
You don't hear Mexicans screaming California was stolen from Mexico in every arguement, do you?
I wasn't involved in slavery, neither was my father, or my grandfather. Neither were you, or your father, or your grandfather.
I would say get over it, but you have nothing to get over, do you?
Joined: Jan 2009
Current Posts: 31
I COULD'NT HAVE SAID IT BETTER MYSELF........
Joined: Nov 2008
Current Posts: 601
Why thank you.
Joined: Oct 2008
Current Posts: 4
********* BRAVO!!! *********
I wish someone would put a gag in her mouth!!
Joined: Nov 2008
Current Posts: 601
lol....I think she finally put me on ignore....LOL
Joined: May 2008
Current Posts: 14
its ok SJ, i still luv ya.
Joined: Nov 2008
Current Posts: 601
Aw shucks...lol
Joined: Oct 2008
Current Posts: 4
her ignore list!!
any one got a sock??
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 19
ha ha ha. that is funny!!
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 19
Applaud!!! Applaud!!
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 2
The Officer should have his right to share his side of the story. The media has sensationalized this story to fit its needs of entertaining television and print. The sheep that make up most of this country ran with these lies and here we are. Let mehserle share his side of the story.To be honest I think most will be shocked to find that this was a mistake, akin to a fatal car accident. No one meant for it to happen but it did. With the help of ignorant people and Burris's inflammatory and overly dramatic remarks things got out of control. I am tired of hearing how Mr.Grant is a saint. He wasn't. He was a criminal. He has a criminal past that made him dangerous to those officers. He shouldnt have put himself in a situation where he could be arrested, this accident couldn't have happened at all had he been sober, not fighting, and didn't flee. A great rule of thumb is don't break the law and cops don't hassle you in the first place. It's a tragedy that the use of force was over the top and maybe more training should be mandatory to carry a taser so as not to confuse it with a firearm ormaybe change taser design flaws. However this is not first degree murder, and grant was just collateral damage to a situatin out of control. Someone look from the officers stand point. A dangerous man fleeing, resisting arrest, drunk. Imagine mehserle's stress and fear in this situation.The Men and Women of Law Enforcement put themselves on the line everyday to protect and serve us,the public, and yes accidents do happen. They are people, mistakes can be made. Criminals should be punished for deliberate criminal activity, accidents don't fall under this Murder category. I wish Officer Mehserle all the best to beat these charges and express sympathy to the grant family.
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 19
LitaG1
“A fatal car accident”??? and we are the ignorant people??? So what does that make you??? Clearly you obtain the same judgmental haughty spirit Pirone and Mehserle had the moment they killed Mr. Grant. Why do you offer judgment to Mr. Burris’s comments and no judgment to the comments the officers gave to the guys when they asked for an ambulance for Mr. Grant?? I wonder how you would react if injustice knocked at your door and killed someone you love. The men and woman of law enforcement CHOOSE to put their lives on the line everyday. They are not forced to be officers. Because they have a dangerous job doesn’t give them the right to commit crimes and call it an accident. I have been harassed by a few police officers in Pleasanton, CA and I do not have a criminal record and don’t plan to have one and BTW each time it happened I was driving the speed limit in an old beat up Cadillac. So your theory on “don’t break the law and the cops won’t hassle you” isn’t totally true”. Mr. Grant did in his past commit crimes and served the time for those crimes. As far as I can remember his sentence wasn’t death! We never said or thought he was a saint, but I’m sure you are right? However we do praise him for the change he was bringing about in his life, after all this is what young people need. Why is that so ignorant to you? Maybe if more people would offer praise and encouragement instead of criticism and pointing fingers in a haughty spirit we would have more people changing for the better. You compare this to a fatal car accident and then offer sympathy to the family? Watch out for the sneaky self-righteous spirit that likes to hang out with you. Please keep your fake sympathy! We are proud of Mr. Grant. He was thinking of his daughter at that fatal moment. Did you see his hands up and then behind his back? Jesus did! Didn’t you see him on his knees? Jesus did!
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 2
you are right people changing, however past crimes do affect the way officers approach you.Change isexcellent, however there is always danger for the officer. Now dont get me wrong i do not believe he(Mehserle) should get away free and clear. I think manslaughter is the right charge. Murder is definitley not. Again from mypoint of view he was struggling. Even hands behind your back and lying prone you can still struggle and get free. He began bucking as you can see in the video, and all it takes is one hand free to grab a weapon. That issomething that has to be an option. The officers did not yet know he was unarmed he was not yet cuffed. So struggling to get free might indicate trying to retrieve a weapon. At that a taser or O.C spray would excellent, however i believe he tried to grab his taser and accidentely drew his firearm. You can see him fumble with his holster. Both weapon are firearm shaped and trigger operated. The officer never looks at his blt keeping his eyes on the subject. Under that stress, plus the fact that you dont aim either,rahter point them i can understand the accidental discharge. Manslaughter. As to my "haughty" attitude I can see how I come off, but I fail to see how this generalization works. Not speaking directlytoyou Lita G1 i see a trend in these forums todenounce ALL law enforcement officials.This is wrong not all cops are bad, and yes not all cops are good. that is like saying everyone in oakland or La or any other high crima area is a criminal. Not the case. In my eyes this a tragic ACCIDENT not an execution. There should be consequences but more fitting to the crime. I do offer sympathy to both parties. I see that the officer is in a terrible situation and the grant family is in a terrible situation. My blame for ignorance is those who think they can ignore the laws and vandals everytime they dont get exactlythier way. I saw the peaceful protestors...I was there however i also saw the ignorant vandals. This call forlife and death penaltyor oakland will burn...OR the claim that the officer willgethis justice in the streets are wrong and ignorant
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 19
You are irritated more about violent protesters than you are about a law enforcement officer shooting a man in the back while he was face down. What is wrong with that picture?? It looks like we are not the only ignorant people around here. I know you would have a very different outlook if you witnessed your brother in law, best friend or cousin, dying, trying to speak with blood coming out of his mouth and when you pleaded or demanded for an ambulance you were told “I will call an ambulance when you shut the @#$% up” . There is much more detail of that horrible scene that you do not know of and frankly, probably wouldn’t care about or wouldn’t believe because according to you we “ignorant” people are telling the story. Just like Mehserle's claim is bogus so is your sympathy. You can't fathom the PAIN, AGONY, or Anger my Family or Oscar's family is dealing with. You tell my niece when she wakes up at night crying for her daddy that it was an accident, but you “offer sympathy”. Tell my sister who wakes up crying in her own pain while having to comfort her daughter who is having nightmares about her daddy, tell her it was an accident, but you “offer sympathy”. Tell the young men who have Oscar blood stains on their clothes/shoes, that in your words this is "akin to a fatal car accident" but you offer sympathy. Your sympathy is bogus and shallow!!! I remain steadfast, it was not an accident! Clearly you remain steadfast as well. One thing I think we can agree on is Let True Justice Prevail!!!
Joined: May 2008
Current Posts: 1383
Judge Jacobsen has drawn conclusions that don't follow from Mehserle's actions. He has shown himself to be biased and Mr. Rains should ask for a change of venue and court. To do so I believe would be doing Mehserle a grave injustice to have to deal with a biased judge.
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 1
How has Judge Jacobson (and it's with an o not an e) been biased? So, ask for a change of court because you think that the Judge is biased? News flash Judge Jacobson won't even be trying this case...... He is not a trial Judge!
Joined: May 2008
Current Posts: 1383
Are death threats to Mehserle and his family politically correct now? The murder of Grant was wrong but ignoring the fact it was committed on his job without premeditation is wrong too. It's also wrong to ignore those making death threats on the other side. Or is that PC now?
Burris has already done all the discovery it appears and only the plaintiff as a right to free media and to tell his side of the story?
If the rulings aren't fair, the case can be appealed. It should be done right. That's all I'm saying. The judge has set a bad precedent in pandering to a mob scene that threatens violence if it doesn't get his way. There have been several officers who most likely have committed cold blooded murder in Oakland. In fact one police officer committed 2 "accidental homicides" as they are called and isn't even being prosecuted. So is it fair to make one individual responsible for all the accidental homicides and irresponsible police shootings as the sacrifical lamb so to speak? I think not but possibly you thinks so.
Joined: Feb 2009
Current Posts: 19
Why speak out now?? [bleep] does he wanna say now. He had every opportunity to talk when the shooting first happened but he remained silent and then quit his job so he didn’t have to talk and now that he has had time to come up with a bull [bleep] story, he wants to be heard in hopes of getting off the hook! Nope!! Do Not Release the Gag order!! He had his chance!
Joined: Jan 2009
Current Posts: 26
There is a major difference between what African Americans have experienced and are still experiencing in America and what Mexican Americans have experienced. To those who think that they are so clever and so well profound and think you can shut me up, TAKE YOUR BEST SHOT!!!! But like I was saying, although Mexicans have experienced some form of racism, it is still not the same as what African Americans experience. And in spite of the fact that Mexican Americans have experienced some form of racism, they are still considered white in American culture. Most Mexican Americans have never been where most black Americans have been through. So do not tell us what we need to do regarding our concerns because you do not have a clue about. And do not tell me how to think, feel, and believe and when it is time for me to get over what I think, feel and believe based on YOUR experiences. You have not been where most black Americans have been. It would be the same if I assumed that because I have been around a few Mexicans who took a stand against unequal pay on their jobs. And I imply that the reason why Mexicans do not deserve equal pay is because they have not been in this country long enough and they do not work as hard as the rest of Americans. So no one has a right to assume anything about anyone unless "they have been there and done that". And I know that there is no way in HELL that you have ever been a BLACK AMERICAN. NO one has the right to make comparison about another person based on their own experiences. You can only speak for yourself! You can only make a determination when it is time for YOU to get over something.
Joined: Nov 2008
Current Posts: 601
I don't see blacks hopping fences and swimming rivers then crossing miles and miles of desert with little or no water to escape civil strife and abject poverty.
I don't see blacks incarcerated in our numbers, period, and Hispanics endure far more police abuse.
I don't see blacks accepting work en masse in carwashes, janitorial services, construction and labor, or house cleaning to make ends meet, and not complain about it.
Unlike African American oppression, hispanic oppression is actively occurring NOW, not 40 years ago.
And everyone who holds citizenship or a green card is protected under the constitution, and should earn equal pay. If you honestly believe otherwise, it is you who are racist.
Now, what have you personally been through in your life that rivals that?
NOTHING.
You have no arguement.
Joined: Jan 2009
Current Posts: 26
You are really lost!! You don't have a clue about what day it is, do you?! You are out there somewhere where the fly ball is! That's why I don't like wasting my time commenting with you. And you have the nerve to talk about me not making any sense?! But, I don't think it's me on this one, missing FLY BOY! But maybe someday you will get it, though. LOUD AND CLEAR!!!
Joined: Nov 2008
Current Posts: 601
meh...
Joined: May 2008
Current Posts: 1383
SJ Marine, you provided a good argument. Enough to set she-gurl off. She can never stand to be debunked without flying into an instant rage and barrage of insults. This is the female poster who just accused me of not allowing others to speak there piece and claimed that I was narrow-minded. LMAO!
It is really hard to debate an individual who is so totally and utterly pararnoid that the first thing she gurl always does is accuse others of trying to silence them when you simply disagree with them. The next things is a string of profanity, insults and attacks upon you. The third and last thing is blocking out the individual because she simply cannot counter what you say. You see she was too full of personal animus this time to really make her usually better case for blacks. So you were able to nail her on the present persecution of Latins in comparison to blacks who sit around in government provided housing getting high, and breeding for a higher welfare check.
And where is it written pray tell that people who haven't lived a long time in a country deserve to be exploited? Ha ha ha. Scratch a black nationalist and not only do you find another bigot, but a corrupt little petit bourgeois who would exploit another race for their own enrichment and try to justify it to boot!
Yep, although I partially agree with she-gurl insofar as what happened to previous generations of blacks (but not the present one), you really nailed her this time. And she responded in her usual typical fury. You know she is so emotionally fragile and insecure that she flies into a thousand pieces the second her thoughts are contradicted and literally shatters online.
Joined: Nov 2008
Current Posts: 601
I usually don't pull the race card. I'll explain the difference between the two cultures, just one time, the way I see it though.
My Grandfather came here in 1945, on a train, after two years college and a year in the Mexican Army, knowing very little english. He went straight to work in the valley, held two full time jobs (One in the field) and went to school part time. Almost twenty years later, during the civil rights movement, He had raised 5 kids, (Losing one in Vietnam) held two degrees, and owned two homes in San Jose.
He never b*tched once about being oppressed, never made any excuses to anyone, he just went out and did what he had to for his family. Now that's a real man.
He's my hero.
Not some civil rights "advocate" who's lining his pockets, not some [bleep]hole Football player or musician who isn't satisfied with easy wealth and decides dogfighting is fun to bet on, or any other horrific so called "role models."
The point I was trying to make, (and there is no sneer in this criticism) If kids in ANY community don't have an honest, hard working father who is around on a day to day basis to provide discipline, guidance and encouragement, or any good role models, what do you think will happen to them?
Joined: May 2008
Current Posts: 1383
SJ Marine, shegurl flipped because of your great example of your great dad and your honesty. You see, she cannot handle honesty and integrity. She needs to vilify. Unfortunately, you didn't fit her "villain role model" so she had to cast you aside LMAO!! And when she couldn't find one in me, she had to make what she felt were cutting remarks of a personal nature because she could not attack my posts or my positions. She specializes in setting up straw men and demolishing them. She just couldn't do it with you.
Keep on truckin' Marine. You know the way baby!
Joined: Nov 2008
Current Posts: 601
Why thank you Traveler.
Joined: May 2008
Current Posts: 14
your father is a great man... thank him for me... and he should be a model to those out there willing to look and listen at what he has done. and you are a great son.
Joined: Oct 2008
Current Posts: 4
***** BRAVO TO YOU, AS WELL *****
Joined: Jan 2008
Current Posts: 752
I'll be glad when all this news media crap quiets down about this shooting. I hope Mehserle gets his act together. I wouldn't be surprise if he was listening to the wrong people about how to treat loud mouthed suspects, especially Oscar Grant. I can hear them telling him now and he's listening, "Man, these drunk parolees are dangerous, you goin' have to break him down, you gots to remind him of WHAT DAY IT IS, who's the MAN!" Yeah, fools needs to know what day it is. That day is, "Mind your damn business!!" And those are usually the same fools who don't have the courage to stop a loud mouthed parolee, because they can't. But they're going to tell somebody how to treat a suspect?! WHACK!! Mehserle is too young to go out like that! I mean, nobody should go out like that! But, it's still plenty of time for him to change. So he needs to get to steppin'!!
Sounds funny, doesn't it she gurl? I just changed the Chris Brown to Mehserle and the Rihanna to Oscar from one of your very own posts. You are very even keeled when your talking about your people committing crimes.